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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 5:46 pm 
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It's basically turning into facebook, where whenever a couple of users want to post something and there isn't already a thread they start a completely new one. Some of these are legitimate, but quite a few aren't and belong in the forums "What do you want to talk about" thread. In addition, we have a couple of threads where some users have spammed about 10-20 pages in the span of one night, by themselves.

^^ Is it just me, or is this a bit too much for any self-respecting forum? A single user should not be allowed to post 20 pages in a row in less than a day, we shouldn't have a large number of pages on the front page of a subforum just being things of quality "Homeless People Suffer and Die -> Just Wanted to get that off my back", and we really shouldn't have half of the front page of the subforum be threads created on a whim where the majority of the thread is off topic because the main topic wasn't so much posted as a serious discussion so much as someone's joke thread.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:25 pm 
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:32 pm 
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Yes well I am using it to point.

Please post something on topic if you are going to post.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:45 pm 
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I never thought I'd say this, but I agree with mjack. it's gotten out of hand.

:duel:

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:46 pm 
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We should make a new board of the goblin underground just for Rag. He's earned it.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:49 pm 
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I also agree with mjack and I wish to state for the record that my spam thread was done to make a point that mjack posted about in this thread.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:50 pm 
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As people have pointed out, it's the offtopic area. As a rule, it is for things that don't belong in other places on the forum. Stop trying to drum up discrimination against harmless types of posting just because you have beef with someone making a thread in jest or enjoying the liberating act of spamming their pointless thoughts.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:51 pm 
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Niklor wrote:
enjoying the liberating act of spamming their pointless thoughts.


I heard twitter and facebook are good for that.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:52 pm 
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deadpoet wrote:
I also agree with mjack and I wish to state for the record that my spam thread was done to make a point that mjack posted about in this thread.

yeah that's a terrible way to make that point. actively making things worse doesn't make things better, it just makes you responsible for how bad they are.

Niklor wrote:
As people have pointed out, it's the offtopic area. As a rule, it is for things that don't belong in other places on the forum. Stop trying to drum up discrimination against harmless types of posting just because you have beef with someone making a thread in jest or enjoying the liberating act of spamming their pointless thoughts.
a) who pointed that out? b) off-topic isn't the same thing as spam. the CoC expressly forbids spam, because it's not harmless, it's disruptive to real discussion.

:duel:

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:55 pm 
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What I want:

- consolidation

You should get in trouble if there is a thrad on poverty and you start a thread labeled "X vs X: Debate Series: Chapter 1 Poverty" or something similar. That's stupid, and it pushes things off of the main page. There is no reason for a duplicate like that, ESPECIALLY in a short amount of time.

- a "good faith" clause where someone actually has to make a thread intending for it to be a serious discussion and not as a joke

This is open to mod interpretation of course, but it's obvious when someone decides to continue a conversation in another thread, it's semi-obvious when something is not meant to be a serious discussion, and I want someone to get in trouble if they have a habit of repeatably creating low quality threads that aren't intended to be actual discussions

- people have to be on topic for that thread

The thing that most infuriates me right now is that people have been banned in the past with the exact reasoning being that they were posting blatantly off topic in a thread in this subforum repeatably, yet now that's mostly what it is.

I don't care if you post off topic every once in a while. But I believe there is posting "off topic" in good faith and just pointlessly derailing the thread. People who do this repeatably should not be allowed to continue doing so.

- the rules to be enforced

If someone posts 3 times in the same thread in the space of 30 minutes, they should get in trouble. There is not a reasonable reason to triple post in that short of an amount of time. And no, I don't think there should be a set amount of time. I think this again should be a "good faith" standard, where I think the mods are smart enough to tell when someone is making 3 good posts and someone is just spamming because they are too lazy to edit their old one.

- a dedicated mod

^^ Because I think it would help in the future. If you can't find one because no one currently on the staff wants to do it, I am sure we can find a volunteer the mod staff will have decent enough confidence in.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:58 pm 
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I agree with basically all of that.

:duel:

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:00 pm 
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razorborne wrote:
[
Niklor wrote:
As people have pointed out, it's the offtopic area. As a rule, it is for things that don't belong in other places on the forum. Stop trying to drum up discrimination against harmless types of posting just because you have beef with someone making a thread in jest or enjoying the liberating act of spamming their pointless thoughts.
a) who pointed that out? b) off-topic isn't the same thing as spam. the CoC expressly forbids spam, because it's not harmless, it's disruptive to real discussion.

:duel:


The point was brought up within the offtopic area itself, not in this particularly thread. I forget who said it or maybe I misread it, though I will say it anyway. It's the offtopic area. It is for things that don't belong in other places on the forum. There you go.

As for the second point, there is a different between disruptive spam and harmless spam. Not much happens in the offtopic room. Sure, if there are quote-on-quote LEGITIMATE TOPICS being buried beneath another user's threads or someone intentionally spamming between two users having a conversation in a thread, you have a case that there is a problem. However, the active topics appear to be floating fine in the puddle of so-called spam threads. I don't see a problem. I see someone trying to make a problem.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:03 pm 
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It's the "Off Topic Room", not the "Do Whatever We Want Because the Mods Aren't Watching And Don't Care" room.

And the spam obviously isn't harmless, because it seems to be bugging multiple users that that is what this subforum has become. There are minimum quality standards that should be enforced, at a minimum enough so that the mod staff can be taken seriously when they make rules on things such as off topic posts, multiposting, and at this point I'm hoping a rule on multithreading.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:05 pm 
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Niklor wrote:
As for the second point, there is a different between disruptive spam and harmless spam. Not much happens in the offtopic room. Sure, if there are quote-on-quote LEGITIMATE TOPICS being buried beneath another user's threads or someone intentionally spamming between two users having a conversation in a thread, you have a case that there is a problem. However, the active topics appear to be floating fine in the puddle of so-called spam threads. I don't see a problem. I see someone trying to make a problem.

not much happens there because a lot of posters are driven away by the spam and derailment.

:duel:

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:06 pm 
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^ That's true too. I know a few users who have stopped posting in the subforum because of this kind of thing.

In fact, I might as well at this rate. It's gone from slightly amusing to very annoying because it's never-ending.

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Last edited by mjack33 on Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:09 pm 
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Evening folks. For the record the issue is currently being looked into by the moderation team. Your suggestions and issues in this thread are being taken into consideration as part of those discussions.

You know just so it doesn't feel like your just shouting into the void here. We are watching and we are listening.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:09 pm 
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So, annoying someone is causing harm?

You're suggesting we ban a behavior not because it is actually causing a problem, like making it hard for your preferred serious discussion to remain visible or preventing users from having a discussion in thread, but because you just don't like it. Sure, there may be some people who agree with you that they just don't enjoy certain behavior, but making rules against someone because you don't like how they post ensuring a minimum quality. It's ensuring a backwards **** of a community where you smile and nod and follow along or you get excluded.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:15 pm 
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You cannot have a forum where the mods selectively enforce the rules. I am not asking for the mods to ban a behavior I don't like. I am asking them to do what they said they were going to do when they signed up to be mods. I am asking them to do what is only fair for the people in that subforum who they have banned for the exact same thing less than a year ago. It's not fair that The Butt should be permabanned for something that users currently get away with scot-free, anymore than this type of thing actually makes the community look good. How do you expect a member of the moderating staff to discipline anyone anywhere on this forum for off topic posts, multiposting, etc. and have them be taken seriously at this point in time?

And you know what? If we are going to allow this kind of behavior in the off topic room then I want the mods to declare their intentions there as well. And make it not against the rules. And let people who have been permabanned for this kind of behavior come back because that would be the other fair end of this situation.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:20 pm 
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Evening folks. For the record the issue is currently being looked into by the moderation team. Your suggestions and issues in this thread are being taken into consideration as part of those discussions.

You know just so it doesn't feel like your just shouting into the void here. We are watching and we are listening.


Thank you

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 7:35 pm 
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mjack33 wrote:
Yes well I am using it to point.

Please post something on topic if you are going to post.

It's been bothering me for a long time and I felt like saying something.
mjack33 wrote:
- consolidation

You should get in trouble if there is a thrad on poverty and you start a thread labeled "X vs X: Debate Series: Chapter 1 Poverty" or something similar. That's stupid, and it pushes things off of the main page. There is no reason for a duplicate like that, ESPECIALLY in a short amount of time.

I don't necessarily disagree with this, but you need to be less ambiguous. At what point does the old topic become too outdated? After it leaves the front page? A week of inactivity? Thread necromancy is usually frowned upon as well.
mjack33 wrote:
- a "good faith" clause where someone actually has to make a thread intending for it to be a serious discussion and not as a joke

This is open to mod interpretation of course, but it's obvious when someone decides to continue a conversation in another thread, it's semi-obvious when something is not meant to be a serious discussion, and I want someone to get in trouble if they have a habit of repeatably creating low quality threads that aren't intended to be actual discussions

What's a serious discussion? Is "I post a picture of a burger each day" a serious discussion? Is that thread not okay in the off-topic room?

mjack33 wrote:
- people have to be on topic for that thread
The thing that most infuriates me right now is that people have been banned in the past with the exact reasoning being that they were posting blatantly off topic in a thread in this subforum repeatably, yet now that's mostly what it is.

I can't really say I know of this phenomenon.

mjack33 wrote:
- the rules to be enforced
If someone posts 3 times in the same thread in the space of 30 minutes, they should get in trouble. There is not a reasonable reason to triple post in that short of an amount of time. And no, I don't think there should be a set amount of time. I think this again should be a "good faith" standard, where I think the mods are smart enough to tell when someone is making 3 good posts and someone is just spamming because they are too lazy to edit their old one.

Your very first sentence is contradictory with the implication that it should not work on a set amount of time. Should a person posting 3 times in the same thread in the span of 30 minutes get in trouble or not? (Which isn't even all that implausible during a normal conversation.)

Niklor wrote:
As for the second point, there is a different between disruptive spam and harmless spam. Not much happens in the offtopic room. Sure, if there are quote-on-quote LEGITIMATE TOPICS being buried beneath another user's threads or someone intentionally spamming between two users having a conversation in a thread, you have a case that there is a problem. However, the active topics appear to be floating fine in the puddle of so-called spam threads. I don't see a problem. I see someone trying to make a problem.

The lack of worthwhile threads to bury does not inherently justify the practice in itself.
mjack33 wrote:
It's the "Off Topic Room", not the "Do Whatever We Want Because the Mods Aren't Watching And Don't Care" room.

And the spam obviously isn't harmless, because it seems to be bugging multiple users that that is what this subforum has become. There are minimum quality standards that should be enforced, at a minimum enough so that the mod staff can be taken seriously when they make rules on things such as off topic posts, multiposting, and at this point I'm hoping a rule on multithreading.

Off-Topic isn't a very meaningful descriptor. There's nothing in the title that logically allows or disallows insubstantial thread creation.
People have different standards of tolerance on various things. You can state your opinion on the matter, but that doesn't mean it should be enforced.

razorborne wrote:
not much happens there because a lot of posters are driven away by the spam and derailment.

:duel:
mjack33 wrote:
^ That's true too. I know several users who have stopped posting in the subforum because of this kind of thing.

In fact, I might as well at this rate. It's gone from slightly amusing to very annoying because it's never-ending.

I know of people that post there more because of it's current state.
Is there a single claim in this thread that is actually backed up by anything solid? I personally visit there enough to know, but this whole "I don't want to mention anyone or anything in specific" is really kind of silly to me.

Evening folks. For the record the issue is currently being looked into by the moderation team. Your suggestions and issues in this thread are being taken into consideration as part of those discussions.

You know just so it doesn't feel like your just shouting into the void here.

Entirely unrelated, but who the hell are you.

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