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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 4:27 pm 
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What is an acceptable Wrath (a "destroy all" or do something bad to all):

1. White can wrath anything
2. Any other color can wrath things in can destroy or harm individually
2a. Black can destroy all creatures, destroy all planeswalkers, destroy all lands, -X/-X all creatures and hit all creatures with -1/-1 counters
2b. Red can destroy all lands, destroy all artifacts and deal damage to all creatures at once
2c. Green can destroy all artifacts, destroy all enchantments, destroy all lands, destroy all planeswalkers, destroy all creatures with flying, and have all creatures fight each other
2d. Blue can return all creatures, planeswalkers, artifacts or enchantments to their owner's hands, and tap any type of permanent with it not untapping during its controller's next untap step.

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Cards have the most value:
1. On the battlefield
2. On the stack
3. In your hand
4. On top of your library
5. In your graveyard
6. At a random point in your library
7. At the bottom of your library
8. In exile

Why does this matter? Because it costs more to get your cards from the bottom of the list to the top, and more to get your opponent's cards from the top of the list to the bottom.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 11:23 pm 
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Checks out with me.
I'd make point 1 part of point 2... which I guess would then be called point 1. You know what I mean, list white with the other colors.

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*"To YMTC it up" means to design cards that have value mostly from a design perspective. i.e. you would put them in a case under glass in your living room and visitors could remark upon the wonderful design principles, with nobody ever worring if the cards are annoying/pointless/confusing in actual play

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2018 1:48 pm 
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Green and white have never specifically destroyed a planeswalker. I think green especially would not get "destroy all planeswalkers" but it could get "destroy all noncreature, nonland permanents" or something.
Green can't make opponent's creatures fight each other (Red can), green would have to have a big creature to fight the opponent's.

Blue has a bit of mass steal like Aura Thief if you want to call that a wrath.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2018 5:56 pm 
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White specifically includes planeswalkers in Fated Retribution and Merciless Eviction.

Do we not consider Bearer of the Heavens ?

Jokulhaups? Decree of Annihilation? Obliterate? Worldfire? Devastation? Those all do creature wrath without damage (among other things).


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2018 10:29 pm 
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I suppose we could say that red can destroy creatures only if they also destroy something else they normally could.

BTW, Bramblecrush can kill a planeswalker.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 12:34 pm 
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Updated!

1. White can wrath anything
2. Any other color can wrath things in can destroy or harm individually
2a. Black can destroy all creatures, destroy all planeswalkers, destroy all lands, -X/-X all creatures and hit all creatures with -1/-1 counters
2b. Red can destroy all lands, destroy all artifacts and deal damage to all creatures at once, and steal all of any permanent type for a turn
2c. Green can destroy all artifacts, destroy all enchantments, destroy all lands, destroy all planeswalkers, destroy all creatures with flying, and have all creatures fight each other
2d. Blue can return all creatures, planeswalkers, artifacts or enchantments to their owner's hands, and tap any type of permanent with it not untapping during its controller's next untap step, and steal all of any permanent type indefinitely
3. Red can wrath creatures as long as the wrath also wraths artifacts and/or lands

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 12:47 pm 
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Bramblecrush can kill planeswalkers but I don't think it will get "Destroy all planeswalkers." It will only get "Destroy all noncreature permanents," and that seems a little dubious.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 4:56 pm 
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Any thoughts on my value of card ranking?

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