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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 11:52 am 
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1)You forgot Rotting Rats. And Strength of Lunacy. And madness-bolt which name I forgot. And Past in Flames with Pale Rider of Trostad, Cutthroat il-Dal with Demon's Jester. Those are all flavorful options.

I would be disappointed if we won't add Slender Man : The Card.

2) To Shade and Yxoque : If we are picking flavorful ab uncommons, Kiss of the Amesha, Juniper Order Ranger and Disciple of Deceit are all very, very good options.
So UW defense, UB control, and WG is open to either +1/+1 counters or token beatdown.
Campaign of Vengeance fits the most cilched explored archetype, and is a flavor win.
Jagged Poppet is good for self-discard, and pretty flavorful.
Savage Ventmaw and Reclusive Artificer are not outstanding, but give access to the most awesome and archetypes.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:20 pm 
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TPmanW wrote:
And the posts I mentioned earlier were apparently the Ultimate Flavor Chanmpionship series. It should be a good resource for a project like this.
The Dark Voting and Conflux nominations
Theros voting and Shards noms
Shards votes and Dark noms
Born of the Gods voting and Journey noms

Oh man I totally forgot that project.

It was really cool, but a killer to run.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 4:07 pm 
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I just rediscovered Quenchable Fire in one of those threads, which is pretty flavourful and also reminds me of its thirsty relative, Mtenda Lion. Obsidian Fireheart also sets things on fire and wins an award for the most flavourful reminder text ever.

Edit: I'd also suggest Sacred Wolf, we still need some green commons after all. The card has very nice artwork and the name and flavour text really get across why it has Hexproof. And I don't want to totally go overboard and fix more archetypes in advance or anything, but maybe there's a way to smuggle in a bit of a wolf subtheme while tying a few other things together. If you look up all cards in Gatherer that say "wolf token" in their rules text, I think a lot of them would be easy to incorporate into the cube without punishing you for just doing your thing and not playing any other wolves. In fact, there might be a good deal of overlap if, say, :w::g: or :g: in general ended up being about tokens, :b::g: cared about creatures dying and :g::r: or :g: in general was about ramp.

Nice token generators that just happen to give you wolves are:
Bestial Menace
Arguably Master of the Wild Hunt, which is also quite flavourful and would really reward you for having more wolves around, but should be kinda okay on his own. Definitely a card that would make wolves and wolf tokens worthwhile.
Pack Guardian can set up a nice little trap for attackers to walk into.
Raised by Wolves is another card that just gives you decent value in limited, represents an old trope, and also synergises really well with additional wolves.
Wolfcaller's Howl is better in multiplayer but might just about work in limited, too, even if it's a bit unreliable.
Wren's Run Packmaster needs an elf to hit the battlefield, but if we reach a critical mass of mana elves etc. it might be playable. It's pretty powerful when it's there and gives your wolves deathtouch.
Sword of Body and Mind, if we can find room for it.

Token generators that might want some ramp:
Howl of the Night Pack
Wolfbriar Elemental

Cards that would work well with a sacrifice/dying theme:
Feed the Pack
Kessig Cagebreakers because sacrificing stuff fills your graveyard.
Predator's Howl

Cards for :w::g: tokens:
Tolsimir Wolfblood

Then there's Fable of Wolf and Owl which I find pretty flavourful and could work for enchantments, tokens, control, and just :u::g: in general. So, yeah, it's really just a suggestion and I understand warping large parts of the cube around some fringe synergy isn't worth it. It's just something we could keep in mind and incorporate if it happens to fit organically. I think it's nice if a cube has some stuff for players to discover between the established archetypes.

And I've mentioned blue cards with Investigate a couple of times, so I might as well bother to suggest some. Confirm Suspicions is certainly flavourful and investigating three times is great. It's just a bit hard to pull off because you need to have five mana open to counter something. Drownyard Explorers foreshadows Emrakul's arrival and gives you a decent blocker in addition to the Clue. Jace's Scrutiny should be fine, Ongoing Investigation lets you investigate repeatedly (and gives you something to do in :u::g:), Press for Answers is also okay in limited. Trail of Evidence has amazing art but is a bit harder to build around. Might be more relevant for :u::b: control than :u::r: artifacts. Gone Missing sort of occupies the same space as Totally Lost, so I guess we'd have to choose between them. Totally Lost is probably more iconic.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 8:08 am 
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Pavor, you're in luck. Green didn't have a lot going on, so there was a ton of room for Wolves.

Going over the cards we have, Red-White seems to go in the direction of combat tricks more than equipment. Blue-Green doesn't have a strong identity yet, but a card-advantage/flash midrange strategy seems to become possible.

It also looks like we're going to go heavily into multicolor, which is fine. We could do with a common multi-colored card for each archetype.

I've also decided that I won't be looking at how much of each category we've already have. We can make cuts as soon as we've filled everything up. With that in mind, White commons and uncommons are underrepresented, as are the Red ones. Green got a recent boost thanks to all the Wolves, but it doesn't have a lot of commons yet. Blue and Black probably have too much already.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:30 am 
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So no more room for Feast of the Unicorn and Memory Lapse?

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:44 am 
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I am disapointed we do not added Puppet, even though we have no other good RB self discard uncommon.
Why Broker over Disciple ? Phenax Girl is so flavorful damn...
No room for Crux of Fate ? Or for Bludgeon Brawl ?
Consider Hoarding Dragon as uncommon... Red flavorful uncommons are uncommon.
For green commons, my other submissions would be Elvish Warrior, Elvish Visionary, and Huntbeast
For green uncommon - Imperious Perfect.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:54 am 
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I assume that, while Crux of Fate is hella flavorful, we'd need way more dragons in the Cube to make it interesting to actually play.

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magicpablo666 wrote:
You fell victim to one of the classic blunders - The most famous of which is "never get involved in an thread with GM_Champion" - but only slightly less well-known is this: "Never go in against AzureShade when card design is on the line!"


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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:58 am 
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The question is "why".
Lots of dragons by themselves are flavortastic !

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:07 am 
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Why would we need more dragons? Because having Crux of Fate read "Destroy all creatures." 99% of the time is boring. Making the choice to kill all dragons meaningful is an important aspect of the card. I'm not against adding more dragons. I'm just saying that Crux of Fate shouldn't be added until we are sure we have a critical mass of dragons.

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magicpablo666 wrote:
You fell victim to one of the classic blunders - The most famous of which is "never get involved in an thread with GM_Champion" - but only slightly less well-known is this: "Never go in against AzureShade when card design is on the line!"


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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:01 am 
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That's what I said. Cube needs more dragons.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:11 pm 
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Yxoque wrote:
Pavor, you're in luck. Green didn't have a lot going on, so there was a ton of room for Wolves.
Nice! It's cool that you like it :thumbsup:

Yxoque wrote:
It also looks like we're going to go heavily into multicolor, which is fine. We could do with a common multi-colored card for each archetype.
Okay, let's see...
Spoiler

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2016 4:18 am 
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My mental state has suddenly deteriorated, but I promise I will finish this. But first I'll have to built an ADHD deck to complement my Depression deck. That did help last time I felt bad.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 7:48 am 
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Oh, okay, I hope you'll feel better soon. But no worries, we'll be ready when you are ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 12:21 am 
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Cheer up ! Life is beautiful ! ,if meaningless...
How those decks look ? :) Post them here, please !

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 10:21 am 
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Depression deck: I think it might actually be too fun to play to fully convey the feeling.
ADHD: This works better thematically, but I think it might be a bit frustrating to play because it goes in so many directions.

I've added some suggestions. If multiple suggestions were made for the same slot, I made a judgment call but I'm generally not married to any one card, so it can be changed later. I'm gonna take some time later to analyze what we have from a developmental perspective.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Fri Dec 09, 2016 8:18 am 
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I just wanted to point out that your list in the OP isn't quite the same as on the deckstats website. Or at least you put Master of the Wild Hunt on deckstats but not in the OP, so maybe it's just that one that's different.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Fri Dec 09, 2016 11:09 am 
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That's correct. I was updating the list at work (don't tell my boss) when I had to leave or miss my train. I updated the list now.

What do we have so far:

We have the following archetypes
  • White-Blue Pillowfort
  • White-Black Lifedrain
  • White-Red Combat Tricks, with a Equipment subtheme
  • White-Green Tokens
  • Blue-Black Control
  • Blue-Red Artifacts
  • Blue-Green ???
  • Black-Red Suicide Aggro
  • Black-Green Graveyard Shenanigans (?)
  • Red-Green Ramp

Each color gets: 17 commons, 8 uncommons, 7 rares, 3 mythics.
The multicolor combinatins get: 10 commons, 20 uncommons, 10 rares.
Colorless/artifact gets: 6 commons, 10 uncommon dual-lands, 5 rares and maybe they can snoop a Mythic of Blue.

Currently we have:
  • White: 7 commons, 6 uncommons, 8 rares, 2 mythics
  • Blue: 16 commons, 10 uncommons, 10 rares, 2 mythics
  • Black: 13 commons, 10 uncommons, 12 rares, 2 mythics
  • Red: 13 commons, 6 uncommons, 10 rares; 3 mythics
  • Green: 4 commons, 9 uncommons, 9 rares, 2 mythics
  • Multicolor: 10 commons, 13 uncommons, 11 rare
  • Colorless: 2 commons, 5 rares

At this point, I'm not as much interested in what to take out, but a lot more in what to put in the missing spots. Blue-Green still needs an archetype and currently it's leaning towards: card advantage, which might be a dangerous archetype.

White and Green need some commons. I suggest Doomed Traveller, Gather the Townsfolk, Master's Call and Wolfkin Bond for the tokens. Curtain of Light; Elite Skirmisher (I'm really digging the art for some reason) and Survive the Night for combat tricks. Howling Wolf for card advantage and more wolves. Servant of the Scales because I've just discovered it and I'm really liking what it does in terms of flavor.

We can also put 3 more artifacts at common. At least one of them should be an equipment I think. Blazing Torch might be interesting, seeing as we're getting a critical mass of vampires (surprisingly few zombies, though). I've always liked what Blight Sickle is doing, but that might be too miserable. Shard of Broken Glass also has a lot going for it.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 2:03 am 
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Raised by Wolves is way cooler than Wolfkin Bond.

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:36 am 
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What about artifacts ?

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 Post subject: Re: Vorthos Cube
PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 4:21 pm 
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I recommend Blight Sickle of the common equipment options. Always loved it and if we get any ping capability it goes beautifully ape.

Might I suggest that :u::g: could do Counter Manipulation? Get some Evolve, some Proliferate, that sort of stuff...

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