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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 8:11 am 
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Chosen by Heliod
Fate Foretold
Scourgemark
Dragon Mantle
Nylea's Presence

I was building my evidently awful deck (will post decklist in a moment) GB draft, and one of the store regulars at my LGS suggested I maindeck Scourgemark over one of my removal spells. That's crazy talk, but there is something to be said about a slow format packed with cantrips and card advantage. So what's your take on the enchantrips?

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:00 am 
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It's highly dependent on the number of heroic guys you have. Cantripping for the sake of cantripping has never been all that appealing to me, unless your deck is overly reliant on a few bombs that you must draw.

Scourgemark and chosen by heliod in particular I probably wouldn't play unless I had some heroic guys. Dragon mantle can actually be decent if you have enough evasion or first strikers and are pretty sick if you play that 1/2 double striker (although I'm not sure how good that little dude is in draft yet). Fate foretold I'm not sure about yet.

Nylea's presence is the odd one out because it doesn't actually trigger heroic. I would only play it if I was 3 colors or had to support a splash. Not worth playing in a 2 colored deck IMO.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:03 am 
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It depends on whether the format is slow-paced, or just highly tempo-relevant. If it's merely slow-paced, then spending 2 mana to permanently increase a creature's power by 1 isn't terrible, and the only risk is really just being stuck with the card in hand because you don't have creatures out. If it's tempo-relevant, a 1-power bump and wasting a turn not doing something more relevant will be very very bad! The only one on that list I would consider playing would be Dragon Mantle. Costing 1 mana and cantripping means that the card is basically free, and the ability is highly relevant! Not only that, but there will be matches against non-red opponents where you just need to dig, and you can cast this on an opponent's creature without risk of them using it against you.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:39 am 
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Scourgemark is pretty great. Everyone likes +1/+0 and draw a card. This one even adds up another point of devotion which is great for black in Limited. I've not yet had a situation in Draft where I was sad to have this card in my hand or on the field.

Dragon Mantle is nice too. It helps with all those low CMC trample cards that red has access to.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 10:46 am 
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They're fine. My favorites are the blue and red ones. Probably pick them 9+ if I'm in the colors, don't play them unless I have heroic.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 11:56 am 
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Nylea's Presence is pretty lame, giving you only mana diversification (really, would Wild Growth have been too much to ask?). Fate Foretold also doesn't buff its creature, but that time when you slap it down on a Sedge Scorpion for the Think Twice/Divination effect? Sweet. Very sweet.

The other three are all playable creature-boosters, specifically because of their cantrip. Chosen by Heliod is arguably the best: it gets any creature out of reach of Phakira's Cure or Magma Jet and anything that started with 2 or more toughness out of burn range entirely, less Boulderfall. Of course, Scourgemark adds static aggression, so that's just fine, but its color doesn't support Heroic the way White does, so I rate it lower. As for cantrippy firebreathing... Like Chosen, it's nice but not amazing: The further mana investment really brings it down. On the other hand, it's 1 mana to start unlike the rest of them, but I still think I'd rather have Scourgemark.

All in all, I think they're decent fill, and better if you're trying to play with Heroic

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:02 pm 
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Playable I guess, but it really depends on your pool. Wanted to add Aqueous Form but I forgot it is scry, not draw.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 12:15 pm 
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Tevish Szat wrote:
Nylea's Presence is pretty lame, giving you only mana diversification (really, would Wild Growth have been too much to ask?).

Wild growth that cantrips would have been really good, even for 2, but more importantly, it would have filled a completely different role. Wild growth accels, but doesn't fix, presence fixes, but doesn't accel. The only similarity, in truth, is that they are both green enchant lands.

What I *am* disappointed in is that it could have cost 1 less mana and would still have been perfectly balanced (see Abundant Growth). At one mana, I would have been happy to play it in a 2 colored deck (not a high pick, but very solid filler). At 2, I'll only play it if I'm splashing a 3rd color.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:48 pm 
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dragon's mantle is supremely playable, considering access to common double strikers. The others are marginal at best, the blue one can be cheap draw if you have a kill or sac on the creature and the black is a fine 23rd card.

i will bump this old ass thread cuz i just got back from theros limited and wanna talk about MAGIC

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 10:57 pm 
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I think yes, with a but.

I would rank them at around:

Mantle
Chosen
Fate
Scourge
Presence

Less for what they do and more for what colours they find themselves in, and has been pointed out, the number of heroic guys and girls in there. Black for example seems more grindy, so the +1/+0 seems a bit pointless and only counts to add to devotion, which it does poorly, but I would play it in a W/B build with the aggressive heroic guys (wingsteed, phalanx etc.)

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:40 am 
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I saw someone post a quadruple Presence build that let them basically go 3-0 in a draft with 5-color. Just a thought.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:31 pm 
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That seems - weird.

I guess you do get a lot of mileage out of being able to cast anything, and Presence draws you to those things. Can't say I'll be looking to force it though.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:00 pm 
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I've seen monogreen run chained to the rock because 2 presence.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:19 pm 
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I have also been able to attack someone with my giant octopus because of presence

its fixing that cantrips and its exactly as playable as that sounds

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