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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 12:22 am 
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I don't run it but seeing how successful I am at getting Crucibles out and by proxy, bigger dragons I'm going to find a way to fit at least one in my deck.
I finished 5 games but I figure 10 maybe 20 might be a better comparison as to how it's still standing up.
5 games so far... 1 win, 1 draw and one game I held on with only one life for a few turns against AG and would have won next turn with a 7/7 Predator if not for a top decked Ring.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 2:53 am 
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I agree with sixty about Soul's fire.. even though I don't run it, I have in the past and it's pretty good. Believe it or not, the deck really does have a sick removal package, but 2/3 of it requires you to have a decent sized creature on the field.

It's one of my favorite decks.. but I'm not blind to it's (rather large) shortcomings.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 6:13 am 
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Soul's Fire gets you blown out by something as simple as Unsummon (among plenty of other things). There's just too much potential tempo loss to make the card worthwhile, IMO. I don't see how 2HG changes that?

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 8:32 am 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
Soul's Fire gets you blown out by something as simple as Unsummon (among plenty of other things). There's just too much potential tempo loss to make the card worthwhile, IMO. I don't see how 2HG changes that?


2HG makes it twice as likely to get hit with something like unsummon. That's a change!

Honestly, I ran soul's fire for a while - it's a great finisher, against some decks. But, it can also be pretty much a dead card or a huge trap. Maybe it's worth it as a one of, if you're careful about when you use it, but, like I said, after being in my deck for a while, it no longer has a home.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 10:09 am 
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NeoSilk wrote:
But, it can also be pretty much a dead card or a huge trap.


This. Plus, it requires us to have a creature out to do anything and this deck isn't good at getting out early creatures, and when the dragons do hit, I'd rather see another dragon in hand than Soul's Fire.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 11:44 am 
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I used to run them all, and I have many many stories of it smacking down the opponent to the face for 10 after I swung for 10. I also have far more stories of having it in my hand and wishing I had a dragon instead. Since promos, took em out, never looked back.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 1:11 pm 
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Well I'm glad to see all the feedback this morning. Never thing about making deck changes when you are drinking.
My deck will dimish, go into the west and remain Galadrial.

I just have to admit that this is not a great 1v1 deck.
Fun to play and all but not very competitive.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:53 am 
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Here's some fuel for mobius (i.e. my awesome play of the day):

I was on the play as EtD vs. AG, and his T2 Champ gets a Banefire for X=1. He follows up with T3 Elite Inquisitor and T4 Knight of the White Orchid getting him to five mana (I Cultivated).

I keep up Jund Charm mana for his two 2/2s and he swings without playing anything. The old me would've just blasted the Charm to save myself four life, but now I take the hit to see if he'll overextend any further. He taps out for Angelic Overseer, so I blast the Charm at EoT, stripping it of its human protection, and cast Maelstrom Pulse when I untap.

If I decide to save myself the four life, he probably doesn't cast Overseer on an empty board there and expose it.

Satisfying win.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:57 am 
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Without knowing what else he had, can't say that was anything other than the right play. I wouldn't have charmed against just 2 anyway, those things are valuable!

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 11:00 am 
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I actually ended up fighting through another Overseer with 1/1 token protection thanks to an X=3 Savage Twister while I had a 4/4 Predator Dragon on board. He O-Ringed my Predator, so I cast Dragon Fodder, Pulsed the O-Ring, and devoured both goblins to get in for eight.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 12:01 pm 
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@Hakeem:

Re: Your Jund Charm into Maelstrom Pulse play........your opponent already isn't playing around Savage Twister there, let alone TWO cards you may/may not have had, so.............congratulations?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 12:04 pm 
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Lol, no real desire to play around any cards like that with AG personally...either you get swept, or you don't, but you hold back and they run you over with a giant dragon. Can't we just agree they both played fine and forget about it?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 12:17 pm 
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"but you hold back and they run you over with a giant dragon"

Disagree. AG can't handle a Dragon? Even if you don't have Path (or leave mana up every turn), it's kinda hard to get 1-shotted by a Haste dragon unless we're on like T17 or something...and then you just untap and Fiend/Ring/Bonds it.

Had Hakeem's opponent been patient, eventually Hakeem would have tired of taking 4 every turn and may have popped the Charm right then if his opponent DIDN'T play out the Overseer/played nothing at all. A player on top of their game would realize that Overseer is very risky in this particular matchup because of the existence of (albeit one) Savage Twister...and there's no real way to protect yourself from a 2-for-1 there if you want to "protect" the Overseer.

HOWEVER, a player CAN protect themselves from a 3-or-higher-for-1 (in Twister's case) or 2 (in Hakeem's example)

Hakeem played fine, his opponent didn't.

tl;dr: KNOW YOUR MATCHUPS

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 12:23 pm 
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@Hakeem:

Re: Your Jund Charm into Maelstrom Pulse play........your opponent already isn't playing around Savage Twister there, let alone TWO cards you may/may not have had, so.............congratulations?


I knew I could count on you! :)

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 12:27 pm 
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Maybe it's just me, but against a deck with some very high powered creatures that can be ramped into, I prefer to go all out rather than play around a single card.

And sure, they can handle a single dragon, usually the turn after if they don't have that path, but ETD is in the almost unique position of being able to get those dragons right back with pulse, even when they get ringed, and the longer that match goes on, the higher the chance of something ridiculous happening, such as a 5 dragon sneak attack (been there so it can happen) or several crucibles making each dragon deal considerable damage before they are dealt with. Playing the overseer was still dumb if he had no more humans, but if he did then the gamble is pretty much a six of one and half a dozen of the other.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 1:17 pm 
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See, now we're getting into weird Sneak Attack and Crucible of Fire plus X amount of dragons scenarios.

I think it was stupid to overextend. You thought it was fine because you think AG can't play a longer game with EtD (and also assuming he didn't have another human to protect Overseer with).

This is the fact of the matter. According to Hakeem's scenario, he took 4 going to I believe 16. He's now on a 4 turn clock. Playing out Overseer there puts him on a 2 turn clock. Without knowing what's in everyone else's hands or what happened afterwards, at this particular point the question being asked should be:

- "Is my hand weak enough that I NEED to shorten my clock by 2 turns to open myself to a potential 3 for 1/3 for 2?"

Maybe it was yes, maybe it was no. We need more context here and not simply "gotcha!" play by plays if we're to gain any real benefit from these posts.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 1:30 pm 
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I went to 14, the Inquisitor got in for two on the turn he cast the Knight.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 1:41 pm 
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So the point of "4 turn clock to 2 turn clock" still stands.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 8:27 pm 
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Here's the ten game run to see if this deck is running with any more advantage in the current 1v1 meta.
I seems like I got a decent cross section of what people are playing now days.

"Dragon Maser"
A library for the Dragons 2014 deck (Enter the Dracomancer)
60 Cards. 35 nonlands (14 creatures, 21 spells). 25 Lands (8 11 3; 3 other).
Open this library in the deck planner. (Learn more)
Land
-- 3x Terramorphic Expanse
cost
-- 4x Dragon Fodder
cost
-- 3x Borderland Ranger
-- 3x Cultivate
-- 2x Jund Charm
-- 4x Maelstrom Pulse
cost
-- 1x Archwing Dragon
-- 2x Hellkite Hatchling
-- 1x Ogre Battledriver
-- 1x Spellbreaker Behemoth
-- 3x Crucible of Fire
-- 2x Explosive Vegetation
cost
-- 1x Broodmate Dragon
-- 2x Dragon Broodmother
-- 2x Predator Dragon
-- 1x Dragon Roost
cost
-- 1x Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund
cost
-- 1x Banefire
-- 1x Savage Twister

Game 1: vs MotD
I start off this adventure ramping harder than Chant. I basically have nothing but land and keep my hand played out so he has nothing to make me discard or exile.
So I won in a certain way.

Loss.


Game 2: vs LoD
Onyx, Ribcage, Ladies and Gentleman The Beatles... early beater from the Demon deck and deathtouch grinds me out before I can make a difference.

Loss.


Game 3: vs UtM
Jund creates an awesome sweep to start bringing in Archwing.
Ogre, Broodmother and then Broodmate to finish.

Win


Game 4: vs D&B
This was one hell of a game. The guy wasn't a very good control player and I got many dragons on board but that combined with his extensive burn added up to a ...

Draw


Game 5: vs AG
This was another good one. At the endgame I held on with one life for 4 turns with a lot of fodder to block and keep me alive.
Crucible gives me a 7/7 Predator that brings him to 6 life and he is dead next turn unless he top decks and answer.
O-Ring sigh.

Loss


Game 6: vs B&B
Stonehorn flickering keeps my army locked down. Sun Titan seals the deal. Oh, this is all with Cathars' out.

Loss


Game 7: vs Chant
Early pressure from Fodders and 3 Pulses kept any damage at bay while he ramped and I Pulsed and then I finished the game with 2 Predators who eat up the fodders.

Win


Game 8: vs SoS
Bad, Bad draws. End up keeping my 5 card hand with 2 swamps and that's it for mana. Next turn draw Swamp...That makes all three I have. Kill one creature with Banefire, play Crucible of Fire and never draw into a Forest or a fixer.

Loss


Game 9: vs B&B
Abuses Cathars' and I cannot respond with a Pulse. Have great stuff but a Pulse and/or the Twister could have given me the game.

Loss


Game 10: vs MotD
Jund and Twister wipes him after I patiently take 10 damage while gathering a Crucible and ramping up. Predator, Ogre and two Fodder ftw!

Win


3 Wins, 6 Losses and 1 Draw.

Comes down to the fact that it still isn't a strong 1v1 deck in the meta. It just needs too many pieces to fall together perfectly to be a threat in the early game or at least successfully stall until the mid-late game power.
Still, a very fun deck to play.
You never know what can happen.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 3:42 pm 
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Been playing this deck lately, and was just taught a painful lesson today, 2 games in-a-row:

Predator Ooze is a cold-hearted, slimy b****.

Nothing short of ramping into Form of the Dragon can stop it.

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