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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:06 pm 
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Mega - You've got both Pilgrimage and Connections in your list. I'm suggesting to consolidate. Drop Pilgrim and add all the connections. Fixing discussion done.

As for enchants, I just touched on my thoughts and what I've been concerned with (and not just those enchants, evoleap etc are still around). I like having additional bodies I can put on the board and swing with while still getting the utility. I'm not saying dump Edict, I'm just suggesting not giving away the Bellower/Sage idea completely. I'd rather keep Edicts for what you probably put them in the deck for and that's the exile clause on Shepherds and Ulamog.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 9:30 pm 
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You know.. I don't think I've ever had an Emeria Shepherd resolved against me in a game.. but yeah.. it would have to go immediately. I also have Rolling Thunder for things like her.. I'd really like to squeeze in the third copy of that, as it's always been good.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:34 am 
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Beast, I don't like the gatecreepers and rumblers in your list. There's enough mana fixing and rumblers are to weak in a ramp deck imo.

I think that you either have to go the hard ramp route or the way hakeem built his deck with some early chumps and evoleap to get the big creatures out.

Here's what I'm playing lately:

3 x Jaddi Offshoot
4 x Natural Connection
1 x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
2 x Radiant Flames
2 x Woodland Wanderer
2 x From Beyond
4 x Mwonvuli Acid-Moss
1 x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 x Planar Outburst
2 x Angelic Edict
2 x Chandra's Ignition
1 x Greenwarden of Murasa
2 x Oran-Rief Hydra
1 x Oblivion Sower
1 x Emeria Shepherd
3 x Plated Crusher
1 x Omnath, Locus of Rage
1 x Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
3 x Plains
3 x Mountain
7 x Forest
2 x Sunpetal Grove
2 x Rootbound Crag
2 x Cinder Glade
2 x Canopy Vista
4 x Evolving Wilds


I don't play Rolling Thunder because Ignition basically fulfills the same role.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:25 am 
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Beast, you really need to hook up that capture card to showcase the awesome destructive power of Grove Rumbler. The world needs to know. Also, can you imagine casting Nissa's Renewal with a Rumbler on the field? What a Timmy blowout!

Oh wait, you don't like Renewal because it "doesn't do anything". :)

To be fair, I think Rumbler would be great at the top end of an aggressive landfall aggro deck. This is not that deck.

@Auunj, I totally missed Oran-Rief Hydra somehow. I think I'll drop my Woodland Wanderers and put those guys in instead. I'm really just trading Vigilance for the ability to keep growing and landfall is awesome with Nissa's Renewal.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:45 am 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
Beast, you really need to hook up that capture card to showcase the awesome destructive power of Grove Rumbler. The world needs to know. Also, can you imagine casting Nissa's Renewal with a Rumbler on the field? What a Timmy blowout!

Oh wait, you don't like Renewal because it "doesn't do anything". :)

To be fair, I think Rumbler would be great at the top end of an aggressive landfall aggro deck. This is not that deck.

@Auunj, I totally missed Oran-Rief Hydra somehow. I think I'll drop my Woodland Wanderers and put those guys in instead. I'm really just trading Vigilance for the ability to keep growing and landfall is awesome with Nissa's Renewal.


I'm not a big fan of chumpable creatures in this meta. There are so mana strategies that can board flood stall as part of their set up, I'd stick with wanderers if I were you. (Not talking about the eldrazis when I say this, and GR has other important benefits).


Last edited by DJ0045 on Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:48 am 
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The Hydra has trample.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:51 am 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
The Hydra has trample.


Lol... My bad, carry on then. Man, I need to mess with some of these ramp decks, I know nothing...


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:53 am 
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Essentially, they are both 5/5 tramples out of the box in this deck. I'm trading the Vigilance and the two-mana discount for the ability to get completely out of hand size-wise.

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Last edited by Hakeem928 on Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:54 am 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
Essentially, they are both 5/5 tramples out of the box in this deck. I'm trading the Vigilance and the two-man discount for the ability to get completely out of hand size-wise.


Yeah, and they both die to the same removals right? Sounds like a solid switch.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:03 am 
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Haven't heard any discussion about Akoum Hellkite, what do people think of him?
Someone just destroyed me with him + Embermaw hellion, i couldn't get anything to stick around and when i finally managed to stabilize they cast Nissa's Renewal for 12 damage to the face, even before it attacked...
Granted that was probably a dream situation but i think it could do some work in a ramp deck somewhere.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:07 am 
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I don't like the Hellkite too much (I only play three mountains) but I really wanted Akoum Firebird in my list and I still may try to squeeze him in.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:43 am 
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DJ0045 wrote:
Hakeem928 wrote:
Essentially, they are both 5/5 tramples out of the box in this deck. I'm trading the Vigilance and the two-man discount for the ability to get completely out of hand size-wise.


Yeah, and they both die to the same removals right? Sounds like a solid switch.


They do, but there are still 3 Plated Crushers just in case you face a Control deck.

@Hakeem: I keep switching back and forth between the Wanderers and Renewal. The Wanderers are Great for a t5 ignition.

Oran-Rief Hydra is a Great Card. She outgrows all the Eldrazi quite quickly.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:54 am 
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Auunj wrote:
DJ0045 wrote:
Hakeem928 wrote:
Essentially, they are both 5/5 tramples out of the box in this deck. I'm trading the Vigilance and the two-man discount for the ability to get completely out of hand size-wise.


Yeah, and they both die to the same removals right? Sounds like a solid switch.


They do, but there are still 3 Plated Crushers just in case you face a Control deck.

@Hakeem: I keep switching back and forth between the Wanderers and Renewal. The Wanderers are Great for a t5 ignition.

Oran-Rief Hydra is a Great Card. She outgrows all the Eldrazi quite quickly.


Yeah, definitely not meant as a critique.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:06 am 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
Beast, you really need to hook up that capture card to showcase the awesome destructive power of Grove Rumbler. The world needs to know. Also, can you imagine casting Nissa's Renewal with a Rumbler on the field? What a Timmy blowout!

Oh wait, you don't like Renewal because it "doesn't do anything". :)

To be fair, I think Rumbler would be great at the top end of an aggressive landfall aggro deck. This is not that deck.

@Auunj, I totally missed Oran-Rief Hydra somehow. I think I'll drop my Woodland Wanderers and put those guys in instead. I'm really just trading Vigilance for the ability to keep growing and landfall is awesome with Nissa's Renewal.


What Rumbler does is give you an earlier presence, the same role as Woodland Wanderer. I know you guys don't like it.. but the card has really performed well. It does it's thing while your deck does it's thing naturally. It also brings opponents into Rolling Thunder range pretty quickly.. and it's an elemental for Omnath.

..and yeah. F Renewal. By the time I get to six mana, I'm DONE ramping.. it's time to start playing threats.. you know.. the thing your deck isn't doing enough of as it durdles along playing Elvish Visionaries again (as usual). I'd also rather have Jaddi Offshoot than Renewal bc if you play Offshoot turn 1.. he's gained you 5 life by the time you get to Renewal mana (even more if you play Evolving Wilds) but Offshoot PREVENTS damage too by stonewalling bears all day, making it a far better survival tool. Now I don't need to play lololol6-mana ramp spells, and can start dropping bombs like a ramp deck is supposed to.

I've played the Hydra a good bit.. it looks good on paper, but it feels kinda win-more. In fact, I've played all the bombs available to us now except the Hellkite and Breaker of Armies.. and Gaea is still the best option IMO. I thought I'd love Plated Crusher but he always underperforms.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:13 am 
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Renewal is not as much about ramp as it is about landfall but skipping from 6 to 9 is huge, especially with Rolling Thunder in the deck. It's not just for Ulamog.

It's fine to think Visionaries are durdling but I like to respect the mana curve. Having early plays is crucial and with the amount of mana the deck can generate, it's hardly a horrible top deck (unlike an Offshoot). If the meta were more aggro they'd be great but I haven't needed them.

Plus I'm playing Evoleap while you aren't. The deck often runs out of Steam and EvoLeap solves that problem. Just because I **** the bed with my play last night while flooding horribly doesn't mean the deck is bad.

I have cut the two Wanderers for Hydras and one Gatecreeper for Akoum Firebird as a resilient threat and a good way to push through damage. I'll be testing on Stream tonight.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:47 am 
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So now your argument for Renewal is that it's great with another singleton. Lol. Landfall? What landfall? Your singleton Shepherd?

Rolling Thunder shouldn't even be a singleton IMO.. the card is super nuts good.

You say you respect the curve, then remove you only REAL early presence (Wanderer) for more 6 drops.. m'kay. Ohh.. and a double red card when your only packing 5 red sources.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:05 pm 
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Omnath has landfall. Now Oran-Rief Hydra has landfall. The card gains seven life. It ramps HARD. It's good.

Seven red sources plus 3 Gatecreeper and 4 Natural Connection. So yeah, five red sources.

But this is pointless. I'll just play your deck. Now get that channel going and show me the power of Grove Rumbler!

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Last edited by Hakeem928 on Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:12 pm 
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I just saw your changes Hakeem. 7 red sources for that many :r::r: cards? I get you've got a fair amount of land fixing but that does seem a touch on the low side to me (not to mention you can only fetch one :r:. The rest you have to draw naturally). Also, why no Evolving Wilds squished in there for all the land fall triggers? Lastly, why the bird? I get you've got a fair amount of land and can bring it back a lot but it just doesn't seem to fit the deck.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:24 pm 
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Because I want to try it, it seems really hard to get rid of and is a nice mana sink later on. Plus it's good against Tutelage (lol). And I only have three cards in the deck that require :r::r:, that's not absurd or anything. I rarely draw the mountain so I grab it and finding one of the other six is not usually a problem. If the bird turns out to be good, I can see me adding another mountain, though.

As far as Evolving Wilds, all my fetching cards get basics so if I play Wilds I have to play four less and remove one every time I crack one. I'd probably run out of basics very quickly.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:52 pm 
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@Hakeem

Running out of basics is a good thing.. it means you're more likely to be drawing action.

I forgot about Omnath. I still stand by the argument of 'when you hit 6 mana, you're done ramping.. you don't need to keep wasting turns ramping. Start winning the F-ing game durdlemeister.'

Please.. play my deck, it won't waste the viewers time watching you flood out for 25 minutes, spam Evoleap for Gatecreepers and Visionaries.. and get hatemail for missing lethal. ;)

Me starting a channel is only being held up by a lack of a quality PC.. but even if I did get one, YouTube seems saturated with Duels content at the moment. You, Kryder, Chickenstrips, Nighthawk, Legend.. that's a lot for the fans to soak up.

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