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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2020 7:26 am 
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Bots underdrafting mill was only in the beginning though? Near the end of ELD I stopped seeing Secretkeepers anywhere as often.

So far I've not found THB particularly great. DOM was truly excellent, while THB is pretty meh - worse than ELD. M19 was okay, while GRN/RNA are not so interesting as well because they're guild formats and there're only five decks.

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On another note here's my latest effort after P1P1ing Purphoros's Intervention (at this rate, I'll actually be sharing literally all the drafts I do, which is a good thing since you guys have probably drafted more than me :) ). As far as I remember I took Mire's Grasp second, then Underworld Charger out of nothing, and slotted cleanly into B/R. I didn't see any of the B/R bombs though, and there's a good chance I wound up in the wrong colors since although this deck has good removal it's sorely lacking in good creatures. At some point I thought I'd start taking green cards in case I switch, and since I was expecting to have more than enough playables, but didn't see green bombs either.

I ended up with 41 cards, which is relatively low in my drafts. What would you cut? I'm thinking a Warleader since it doesn't look particularly strong for a 5-drop and I have four of them; however I do have Portent and potentially Anax tokens to sacrifice to it. Some cards in the sideboard could be better off maindeck as well, in particular Wings, since I seem pretty short on ways to win if opponent lands a single big creature. Bronze Sword might be unplayable. It doesn't seem that bad to me because I have lots of small creatures to suit up, but I've literally never seen an opponent play the card against me.

How good is Minion's Return without ETB effects? I'm guessing it's unplayable without aura synergies?


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2020 8:25 am 
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Banedon wrote:
Bots underdrafting mill was only in the beginning though? Near the end of ELD I stopped seeing Secretkeepers anywhere as often.

Yes that's possible, but I only draft in the beginning of a set and constructed after achieving rare completion.

Your current pool isn't great, but I'd make a few changes. The red 1/3 that can loot is quite nice, better than your other 2-drops except for Tymaret imo.

I would never run Bronze Sword and I like Wings and Lantern - though the latter is clearly a SB card in Bo3.

I agree that you might have too many 5-drops, though they are a sac outlet for the otherwise useless Portent of Betrayal.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 28, 2020 11:44 am 
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Def run wings over sword. Helps your rage hound not straight suicide, and you need the evasion on your 4 power creatures or pumped oracles to win I think.

I’m not very high on 1/3 looter myself (ok, but I think your other 2 drops are better) - but if you do sub it in I wouldn’t cut the lampad for it. Want the cheap sac outlet for the steal spell and you’ll want the reach to help close

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 29, 2020 2:51 am 
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Ok, +1 Wings -1 Sword -1 Omen since as I wrote I don't have good creatures anyway. Currently 1-1. Frustrating two losses in the first match: first I color screwed out of black, then I color screwed out of red. It's possible I could've played better in game 3 but not drawing any swamps in game 2 was lethal. A single swamp would likely have won the game.

BO1 draft is back, so I started up another draft in the meantime. P1P1 what's the pick? Purphoros, Anax, Thernody Singer, Dreadful Apathy, Final Death, Iroas's Blessing?

Purphoros does not seem playable, the static effect is "meh", the active effect is "whatever", and his only value would be if he can manifest. If I could take all three red cards here he'd likely be great, but I'm skeptical that's realistic.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 29, 2020 4:29 am 
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That pack sure is loaded.

You obviously aren't rare drafting, so let's treat the mythic as a regular card. First card to rule out is the blue one because you don't want to play blue unless you open a super-bomb. 3 red cards could be a reason to pick one so the others can wheel. I have no experience with Anax in the draft where neither Embercleave nor sweeper protection are factors. He's probably just a big butt that makes random tokens from time to time. Definitely a good creature for 3 but I guess you're better off picking removal.

Now of those three cards, the red one is the weakest, so you'd pick it for the reason outlined above. Final Death and Dreadful Apathy are among the very best commons overall. I could see picking the latter because it comes online earlier, allows exiling too for just one more mana and if you flicker it with the exile ability on the stack, that's a homerun. So it has more possibilities but also has a fail case where your opponent bounces it's target.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:20 am 
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I'm going to step in and say the cost is screwy, yes, but Underworld Dreams has won me many games by just sitting there pinging away. One more last night. I believe you will find Rakdos is the best way to go in limited if you can. I have my highest win rate with it.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 29, 2020 3:10 pm 
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Banedon wrote:
BO1 draft is back, so I started up another draft in the meantime. P1P1 what's the pick? Purphoros, Anax, Thernody Singer, Dreadful Apathy, Final Death, Iroas's Blessing?


Purphoros is bad unless you’re heavy red to reliably turn him into creature. Ability not useful with limited creature pools. Not a P1P1. Maybe pack 3 grab if you’re looking mono red, but I’d stay away otherwise.

Agree about avoiding U unless you have a bomb. Singer is pretty good if you’re there, but not an early pick due to general color weakness in this set.

Anax is good but not a bomb. Happy to have him in any red deck, but I’d go removal here. Personally think Death is the pick due to color strength this set. Apathy is perfectly justifiable and better than Blessing, but I could see taking blessing with hope red wheels (tho Anax prob won’t).

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:40 pm 
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Purphoros removes a mythic from the pool, so him unless you have 4,


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 29, 2020 10:18 pm 
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Original Build

Thoughts on this build? Was UW through most of pack one (P1P1 was ECD) till the bots beat me over the head that black was open with a wheeled Blight-Breath Catoblepas.

Not sure about Hateful Eidolon. In terms of Opp creatures dying, Mogis's Favor is pretty hit or miss with targets and I've only got one Mire's Grasp as a payoff otherwise. Favors or Sentinel's Eyes on my creatures seems like it could create enough extra triggers for it to be worthwhile?

Transcendent Envoy is a bit underwhelming here, but wears Favors or Eyes well enough. Wondering if I should swap in a Scavenging Harpy (maybe for Grim Physician or one Underworld Charger, as I have plenty of Escape cards anyway?), though it can't wear Favor at all. Thinking Omen of the Dead probably doesn't make the cut as there's nothing I'm really excited to rebuy.

Edit: Liking this build more now I think about it:

Image

Daxos and Physician don't really have a place here and I trimmed a Mogis's Favor as it's not all that impactful. Added Thief (curve filler) and both Harpies (adds some evasion).


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:10 am 
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Looks like a good deck. I'd probably play the 2nd Mogi's Favor, possibly Aspect as well, cutting Scavenging Harpy. Point is that Hateful Eidolon really likes Mogi's Favor. Even if your opponent doesn't have X/1's, you can enchant your own creatures and force trades which still draw you a card (and gain 3 life if you put it on the Eidolon itself). You will have a lot of escape cards though, which might be a problem. I'd definitely run Daxos as well. It's not that it "doesn't really have a place", but that it is simply a good Magic card. Possibly cut an Underworld Charger for Centaur Courser to have fewer escape cards, too.

B/R run ended 2-2. "Lost" the 4th match because the client timed me out. Unfortunately enough, my connection seemed to be working fine at the time, so idk what happened.

Also hit 7-1 in ranked with this deck, making maximum wins for the first time!

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After taking the Final Death I got passed the GW rare lion, and I was like, gonna pick this anyway even though it was possibly not the best idea. Still, I did end up with what was a pretty good GW deck. I lost one game. Opponent had Dream Trawler.

- Never got to assemble the Karametra's Blessing + Hydra's Growth combo.
- Bronzehide Lion turned out not to do anything too substantial this run, but of course it's a good card that deserves its status as a rare.
- Siona missed several times ...
- Commanding Presence was typically not very good, generally adding 2 damage for the turn and making a 1/1. After that the enchanted creature is usually neutralized. It's risky to put it on my biggest creature too for that reason, but on a smaller creature, it's not as effective (less first strike damage).
- I benched Chainweb Arachnir and don't regret it. The only time it could have mattered was against an opponent with Artemisia. Otherwise it would just be a crappy 1/2 reach that's waiting for a chance to escape.
- Decided not to splash Final Death because I had Labyrinth, which turned out to be very strong. It breaks up group blocks and stops Staggering Insight like nothing else can.
- Closest game in the run was one where I got opponent down quite low, but then he had Nexus Wardens, Daxos, and Sentinel's Eyes to go back up. Later Captivating Unicorn tapped several of my blockers and let him attack too, but I had lots of 1/1s (thanks Hoplite & Commanding Presence) and was able to chump a bit. He probably attacked too aggressively at one point, losing the Unicorn and another creature, in order to drop me to 1 life. I stabilized then and Destiny Spinner started making 6/6s that wore down his defenses and won me the game.
- It's very likely I got this far because of inferior opposition, given the new season and all.

Next draft, P1P1 is probably Elspeth's Nightmare over Treacherous Blessing, Warbriar Blessing, Callaphe, and Commanding Presence.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2020 3:33 pm 
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I generally agree that Daxos is a good Magic card but, being so light on white in that deck, it wouldn't be much more than a hard to cast bear. I ran the build as posted and went 6-3. Lost first two after not respecting Favored of Iroas in G1 and kept a hand without enough action G2. Got six wins before losing to mana screw in my last game. Felt bad for my Opp for my 5-X match, this was their hand and board state after I took a peek with Nightmare:

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:25 pm 
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So I had thought tower-wave mystic was jank. But when there's two of them, beating you down, with starlit mantle and other **** to increase damage/protect, it's a scary situation. First time losing to mill in Theros.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:56 am 
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Banedon wrote:
Also hit 7-1 in ranked with this deck, making maximum wins for the first time!

Next draft, P1P1 is probably Elspeth's Nightmare over Treacherous Blessing, Warbriar Blessing, Callaphe, and Commanding Presence.

Nice! Finally :)
Nightmare is probably the right call. Kill a creature, discard a card and exile gy with the fail case that one of the first two chapters whiffs. Also looking at opp's hand is quite the thing.

Treacherous Blessing could be awesome if you can get rid of it. Otherwise it just kills you, more of a constructed card imo. Goes into Doom Foretold and sacrifice decks.

Warbriar Blessing is #2 in this pack for me after Nightmare. I've always liked it, you just need to have a reasonable creature to put it on. Commanding Presence is often the best card in a pack, just not this time.

And the blue card, whatever.. see above. Timmy said the same thing, so believe us :)

DCG-MTG wrote:
I ran the build as posted and went 6-3. Lost first two after not respecting Favored of Iroas in G1 and kept a hand without enough action G2. Got six wins before losing to mana screw in my last game. Felt bad for my Opp for my 5-X match

Grats on 6-3 with BW - you're now the authority on that color pair here :D
Poor opponent though, these non-games suck.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2020 4:36 am 
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Went 4-3 in my next draft. Made three mistakes in all three losses:

1. Opponent has a freshly-cast Nylea's Forerunner on the battlefield and a 3/4 enchanted with two Sentinel's Eyes. I'm at 1 life. He attacks, I only have a Voracious Typhon to block with, and the only instant I have in hand is Mystic Repeal. I'm dead even if I bottom one of the Sentinel's Eyes. I concede. Immediately afterwards, I see the play that would've kept me alive, and since I can escape Voracious Typhon the next turn, I'm not dead.

2. With The Akroan War on the battlefield, opponent takes my 5/4 Berserker, but does not attack. My board is 3/3 deathtouch and 3/3 Beetle (having already made a mistake earlier in not playing my 4/3 Nyxborn Marauder instead of the Heirophant, to trigger the Beetle). Opponent's board is Stampede Rider, a 1/3, a 2/3, my 5/4, and his 4/5 Warleader. I play Warbriar Blessing targeting my Heirophant and his Warleader. I figured I would either get him to sacrifice (in which case it's 2-for-2), or get a free kill. How stupid can I get? Of course I should've enchanted my Beetle so it survives The Akroan War.

3. I disconnect, then upon reconnecting, chose not to untap Entrancing Lyre on my opponent's Pharika's Spawn. And then I realize opponent had just played Aspect of Hydra. Never had the mana to tap down the Hydra'd creature afterwards.

tl; dr: if you play badly, you will lose. Can't complain.

Next draft, started out really weird with P1P1 Banishing Light, then P1P2 Banishing Light, then P1P3 Banishing Light, and then getting passed yet another Banishing Light in pack 2. Was fortunate enough to open Archon in P3P1 as well, followed by the other Archon P3P2.

Image

What would you cut? I'm thinking Storyteller, on the grounds that my best enchantments tend to stay on the battlefield, could cut Flicker too or perhaps a Karametra's Blessing/Soulreaper of Mogis (but I do have Reverent Hoplite and Discordant Piper tokens to sac to it).


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:35 pm 
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Might be a Karametra’s blessing.

I wouldn’t cut flicker - very useful tool here. Save Archon from targeted removal, flicker an enchantment to get another Pegasus token, or Hoplite to get more 1/1s, or Catoblepas to kill something, or an opponents creature to shrug off aura stack, etc.

Glory Bearers is your weakest 4 drop, but it’s an enchantment trigger for Archon and makes your hoplite tokens survive attacking into 1/Xs.

I like Storyteller - you don’t have a great pool for it, but in a pinch you can gain some life putting an enchantment creature back on top. Also be nice to fetch back a Banishing Light that got Naturalized.

I wouldn’t cut Soulreaper. You’ll have tokens to convert to card draw and it plays with your enchantment synergies.

I think you could reasonably cut Blessing, Bearers, or Storyteller - but I wouldn’t cut Soulreaper or flicker.

Transcendent Envoy is kinda bad in your deck, but I don’t think you can cut it to get to 40 cause your creature density is stacked at 4CMC+. Wayfinder is better, and I’d lean towards that instead of Envoy. Only thing that makes it a decision point is Envoy is enchantment trigger for Archon. Might be worth cutting Pilgrim for Wayfinder, since you only have 2 auras - both are solid but not spectacular - and Pilgrim is bad if you’ve drawn both.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 8:50 am 
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Banedon wrote:
Went 4-3 in my next draft. Made three mistakes in all three losses:

1. Opponent has a freshly-cast Nylea's Forerunner on the battlefield and a 3/4 enchanted with two Sentinel's Eyes. I'm at 1 life. He attacks, I only have a Voracious Typhon to block with, and the only instant I have in hand is Mystic Repeal. I'm dead even if I bottom one of the Sentinel's Eyes. I concede. Immediately afterwards, I see the play that would've kept me alive, and since I can escape Voracious Typhon the next turn, I'm not dead.

You may have lived for Mystic Repeal is not what you think it is. But would you have won or just delayed the inevitable?

Quote:
2. With The Akroan War on the battlefield, opponent takes my 5/4 Berserker, but does not attack. My board is 3/3 deathtouch and 3/3 Beetle (having already made a mistake earlier in not playing my 4/3 Nyxborn Marauder instead of the Heirophant, to trigger the Beetle). Opponent's board is Stampede Rider, a 1/3, a 2/3, my 5/4, and his 4/5 Warleader. I play Warbriar Blessing targeting my Heirophant and his Warleader. I figured I would either get him to sacrifice (in which case it's 2-for-2), or get a free kill. How stupid can I get? Of course I should've enchanted my Beetle so it survives The Akroan War.

What's the difference? Your 3/3 beetle could've become 3/5 and kill the 2/3 Stampede Rider before combat. Then it dies to his 4/5. Your deathtoucher gets blocked by your own 5/4 getting both killed.

Quote:
3. I disconnect, then upon reconnecting, chose not to untap Entrancing Lyre on my opponent's Pharika's Spawn. And then I realize opponent had just played Aspect of Hydra. Never had the mana to tap down the Hydra'd creature afterwards.

You disconnect a lot. Where do you live and on what kind of hardware do you play? I'm in Germany with a regular PC from ~2013 and (almost) never have any issues.

Quote:
Image

What would you cut? I'm thinking Storyteller, on the grounds that my best enchantments tend to stay on the battlefield, could cut Flicker too or perhaps a Karametra's Blessing/Soulreaper of Mogis (but I do have Reverent Hoplite and Discordant Piper tokens to sac to it).

I'm no fan of Flicker without it's partner in crime Dreadful Apathy - Timmy listed a few nice applications though.

Two Karametra's Blessing are a lot when you're not building a voltron. You do have a bomb that's worthy of protection with the rare Archon, but it's not an enchantment on it's own, so the blessing will only add 2 temporary hit points which doesn't stop that many cards.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2020 12:34 am 
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Can't tell about whether I'd have won if I'd played Mystic Repeal correctly, but I'd certainly have lived, which is a start. As for Beetle, I had other 4-power creatures in hand to buff it. It's certainly possible I would lose anyway though. The Akroan War is very strong. As for the disconnects, I think it's a hardware issue to be honest. Everyone'internet connection fails some time, even if only briefly (like for 20s), but these short-duration disconnects aren't usually fatal since you can always reconnect. But with my hardware, MTGA is often "not responding" while reconnecting, and by the time I reconnect I've already lost. I know this laptop's been dying for a while, but the laptop I brought to replace it experienced its own hardware issues too and is being repaired. Cest la vie.

Still haven't played that run. Is Flicker really unplayable without Dreadful Apathy? Seems like I have some ETB effects to flicker, plus it removes auras from both my creatures and opponent's. Karametra's Blessing should be playable even without enchantments - it's a 1-mana +2/+2 combat trick after all.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:26 am 
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Banedon wrote:
Is Flicker really unplayable without Dreadful Apathy? Seems like I have some ETB effects to flicker, plus it removes auras from both my creatures and opponent's. Karametra's Blessing should be playable even without enchantments - it's a 1-mana +2/+2 combat trick after all.

Get an actual PC ;)
Laptops are overused imo, you only really want one when you intend to use it in different locations.

Timmy listed some applications for Flicker so there's probably a chance you get to make use of it. Maybe it's like a counterspell, it can be useful but only when an opportunity arises.

Blessing however, why would you want a +2/+2 combat trick? Your only creature worthy of spending a card to save it is the Archon. And since that's not an enchantment, you're not getting hexproof and indestructible so it requires a very niche scenario to actually mean the difference between life and death.

Oh and your beetle from the old game would be dead anyway. I don't see how you would've saved it against so many blockers when you have to attack.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2020 12:52 pm 
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Flicker is pretty good this set. Obviously the apathy trick is strong, but it’s good even without apathy. This set is full of ETB triggers thanks to constellation and several auras with ETB effects, auras are everywhere to shrug off, and there’s a good amount of targeted removal to dodge. Flicker offers a lot of utility in Theros. The first flicker often makes the cut imo

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:06 pm 
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Very compact curve for this deck, went 7-2. Swapped in a Portent for one of the Chargers after a few games. P3P1 was Spawn over second Mire's Grasp, still not sure which was correct in retrospect. Third Opp had Ashiok (was fortunately able to Eat it immediately) and Uro. Played around it by not using Lampad to sac a Charger that had a One with the Stars targeting it (would've given Opp fifth card in GY to escape Uro) and topdecked Harpy to exile Uro.

Opened 96 packs total now between sealed and draft and still only have 6 mythics! Hoping for better luck with the reward packs.


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